On the “I’m with you line”, two additional keys to that scene. First, Vito’s tears as he realizes his son is there with him while also acknowledging the destruction of those hope and dreams he has for Michael that he alludes to later. In that moment, the idea of Governor Corelone is dashed. Second, the scene on the steps outside the hospital with Enzo after the assassins drive off. Enzo tries to light a cigarette but his hands are shaking too badly, but Michael is as cool as they come, lights the smoke without a problem and acknowledges this with a brief look as he closes the lighter. Perhaps a realization he was indeed meant for this.
Excited for these discussions. Keep up the good work.
Sonny’s crack about being in the army and shooting them from a mile away is a (another) subtle reminder that Sonny, for all his bluster, doesn’t have a clue about anything. The things Michael has undoubtedly seen as a war hero.
Consensus is rapidly forming over the best moment in The Godfather. Small sample size, but still. (Thanks for subscribing. You're with your people on these boards, clearly.)
I've never really delved into Godfather trivia before but whoa, a Yates version sounds hella interesting to me. I'm sure it wouldn't have been as good but I probably would love it - more grubby, more bummed out, less musical.
I do love a few other Coppola movies but one thing that this movie and it's weirdly poured-over-process kind of show is just how much movies are collaborations and how many people doing great work together really can add up to a lot. I have doubts that this would ever get rebooted or remade or sequalized - just feels like it looms too large (like The Exorcist - just easier to rip off what you want), but, it feels like a prime target for a "let's make a movie about how this movie got made" pass.
Yeah, Yates was the name that leapt out to me in that list of potential directors. (I'm a huge Peckinpah fan, but he would have been about the worst imaginable choice.) Coppola famously fought Paramount to keep the film as a period piece, but if it had been set in the early 70s, and the script had been right, Yates could have made a real classic of his own.
Great discussion here gentlemen and forced me to finally pull the trigger and move up from subscriber to paying subscriber.
For me the greatest moment of The Godfather is after the assassination attempt. Michael and the florist stand on the hospital steps and the young man tries to light a cigarette but he's shaking so hard he can't do it. Michael, his hands still, does it for him.
I had never considered the impact of the dissolves leading to the horse's head reveal, but you're assessment is bang on Scott.
A moment that stands out to me is when Michael is on the phone w/ Sonny describing the situation at the hospital. "Papa's all alone." hammers home the mounting dread Coppola builds to with Michael's discovery of an empty hospital (side note - is this scene the origin of the empty hospital setting in horror?) While most pinpoint this as the moment we realize why Michael should be the successor as the head of the family, I've always loved the way we are shown how ominous the situation is.
I'm glad you said that, I got deeper into movies through an obsession with horror and I remember seeing this for the first time around that period and thinking that hospital scene was legitimately scary for how quiet it is.
I have three vivid memories of the first time I watched The Godfather:
1. My best friend actually blind bought the set when we both worked at the mall and I remember being intensely jealous for a hot minute because he had seen one of the greatest films ever made (according to everybody) and I, the budding cinephile, hadn't.
2. I discussed this below but as a horror obsessive at the time I was struck by how legitimately scary the hospital scenes are. The dread of those empty hallways is intense still to this day.
3. So, I watched Hot Shots with some regularity when I was a kid and I remember when Don Vito is addressing the heads of all the families at that meeting and I realized that they were the five families Lloyd Bridges refers to in his eulogy during the funeral scene. To quote Captain America, I had a "I understood that reference!" moment in reverse.
"Pete 'Dead Meat' Thompson is dead. So is Mo Green, Tataglia, Barzini, the heads of all the five families. It is at moments like these, my dear friends, that we must ask ourselves: "How can this not be part of some larger plan?" Do good men like Dead Meat Thompson just blink out one day like a bad bulb? I mean, one minute you're in bed with a knockout gal... or guy, and the next, you're a compost heap. Doesn't that bother any of you? Because it scares the living piss outta me!"
I just saw The Godfather in a theater thanks to its 50th anniversary re-release...and it is hard to argue against its brilliance. That opening line! In terms of when Michael is turned, it has to be in the hospital. Vito is about to be assassinated - for a second time! - and it becomes clear to Michael that he is the only person in the family that is able to protect his father, both in this circumstance and in the future. Fredo was incapable of handling any trouble the during the first around, and Sonny is asleep at the wheel. And when he is beaten by the police captain, it becomes clear to him that ALL institutions are corrupt, and those sanctioned by the state even more so. The world is truly against his family, and he will fight for his family. There is one moment when he can turn back. When sitting at the Italian restaurant, you hear an overhead subway train (is that visually established? I honestly don't remember) rumbling through the place and mirroring Michael's stress as he decides whether to cross this line. But he does...and then there is no going back.
On the “I’m with you line”, two additional keys to that scene. First, Vito’s tears as he realizes his son is there with him while also acknowledging the destruction of those hope and dreams he has for Michael that he alludes to later. In that moment, the idea of Governor Corelone is dashed. Second, the scene on the steps outside the hospital with Enzo after the assassins drive off. Enzo tries to light a cigarette but his hands are shaking too badly, but Michael is as cool as they come, lights the smoke without a problem and acknowledges this with a brief look as he closes the lighter. Perhaps a realization he was indeed meant for this.
Excited for these discussions. Keep up the good work.
I always remember Michael was a war hero in that moment. Now he's fighting a different kind of war but using some of the same skills.
Sonny’s crack about being in the army and shooting them from a mile away is a (another) subtle reminder that Sonny, for all his bluster, doesn’t have a clue about anything. The things Michael has undoubtedly seen as a war hero.
I commented just to bring up the lighter scene and failed to notice you already had. Yes! Such a powerful (and small) moment.
Consensus is rapidly forming over the best moment in The Godfather. Small sample size, but still. (Thanks for subscribing. You're with your people on these boards, clearly.)
Great stuff folks!
I've never really delved into Godfather trivia before but whoa, a Yates version sounds hella interesting to me. I'm sure it wouldn't have been as good but I probably would love it - more grubby, more bummed out, less musical.
I do love a few other Coppola movies but one thing that this movie and it's weirdly poured-over-process kind of show is just how much movies are collaborations and how many people doing great work together really can add up to a lot. I have doubts that this would ever get rebooted or remade or sequalized - just feels like it looms too large (like The Exorcist - just easier to rip off what you want), but, it feels like a prime target for a "let's make a movie about how this movie got made" pass.
Yeah, Yates was the name that leapt out to me in that list of potential directors. (I'm a huge Peckinpah fan, but he would have been about the worst imaginable choice.) Coppola famously fought Paramount to keep the film as a period piece, but if it had been set in the early 70s, and the script had been right, Yates could have made a real classic of his own.
Great discussion here gentlemen and forced me to finally pull the trigger and move up from subscriber to paying subscriber.
For me the greatest moment of The Godfather is after the assassination attempt. Michael and the florist stand on the hospital steps and the young man tries to light a cigarette but he's shaking so hard he can't do it. Michael, his hands still, does it for him.
I had never considered the impact of the dissolves leading to the horse's head reveal, but you're assessment is bang on Scott.
A moment that stands out to me is when Michael is on the phone w/ Sonny describing the situation at the hospital. "Papa's all alone." hammers home the mounting dread Coppola builds to with Michael's discovery of an empty hospital (side note - is this scene the origin of the empty hospital setting in horror?) While most pinpoint this as the moment we realize why Michael should be the successor as the head of the family, I've always loved the way we are shown how ominous the situation is.
I'm glad you said that, I got deeper into movies through an obsession with horror and I remember seeing this for the first time around that period and thinking that hospital scene was legitimately scary for how quiet it is.
I have three vivid memories of the first time I watched The Godfather:
1. My best friend actually blind bought the set when we both worked at the mall and I remember being intensely jealous for a hot minute because he had seen one of the greatest films ever made (according to everybody) and I, the budding cinephile, hadn't.
2. I discussed this below but as a horror obsessive at the time I was struck by how legitimately scary the hospital scenes are. The dread of those empty hallways is intense still to this day.
3. So, I watched Hot Shots with some regularity when I was a kid and I remember when Don Vito is addressing the heads of all the families at that meeting and I realized that they were the five families Lloyd Bridges refers to in his eulogy during the funeral scene. To quote Captain America, I had a "I understood that reference!" moment in reverse.
"Pete 'Dead Meat' Thompson is dead. So is Mo Green, Tataglia, Barzini, the heads of all the five families. It is at moments like these, my dear friends, that we must ask ourselves: "How can this not be part of some larger plan?" Do good men like Dead Meat Thompson just blink out one day like a bad bulb? I mean, one minute you're in bed with a knockout gal... or guy, and the next, you're a compost heap. Doesn't that bother any of you? Because it scares the living piss outta me!"
I just saw The Godfather in a theater thanks to its 50th anniversary re-release...and it is hard to argue against its brilliance. That opening line! In terms of when Michael is turned, it has to be in the hospital. Vito is about to be assassinated - for a second time! - and it becomes clear to Michael that he is the only person in the family that is able to protect his father, both in this circumstance and in the future. Fredo was incapable of handling any trouble the during the first around, and Sonny is asleep at the wheel. And when he is beaten by the police captain, it becomes clear to him that ALL institutions are corrupt, and those sanctioned by the state even more so. The world is truly against his family, and he will fight for his family. There is one moment when he can turn back. When sitting at the Italian restaurant, you hear an overhead subway train (is that visually established? I honestly don't remember) rumbling through the place and mirroring Michael's stress as he decides whether to cross this line. But he does...and then there is no going back.